The Methodists have women ministers? Thats whatcha get when Free Will runs amok. John Wesley must be perpetually trying to explain himself to Whitfield. "No, see, that's not what I meant!"


Joffre adds: I was chilling at a local restaurant/pub last night, reading a little of the Chilean bard. This place is the kind of place where a guy I fell into conversation with, finding that he was voicing some relatively martial opinion, felt he had to add, "Of course, I'm definitely not a supporter of George Bush or anything." Anyway, I was able to overhear a discussion a couple of tables down, and one of the lines I overheard really stuck in my head, and I admired it for its worldview consistency: "If I want to marry this chair, I should be able to." Now that's an unabashed redefinition of marriage, on a ground-breaking scale. Why would you want to hide your chair-love behind the veil of marriage? Be unabashed, unashamed in your self-gratification! Eschew the fuddy-duddy concept of marriage! But no. Ah, neo-pagans...as Remy has said, at least the Romans had cojones.